Math Quesrion: I'm worried I have messed up!

[fullhands_fullheart]

I need advice and reassurance. I am worried about my kids math skills. A little background. My 1st grader, Noah, is soon finishing up Saxon 1. I am not too worried about him, as he is young enough that I can easily switch him over to Singapore or MathUSee or whatever without much worry. He has been homeschooled from the beginning.

Elissa, my 3rd grader, and Seth, my 5th grader, were in private christian school until this school year. That school used Saxon, so that's what we stayed with upon pulling them out. Well, I couldn't keep up with it all. Trying to teach 3 different Saxons was kicking my butt. My hodge-podge of curriculum has made cause for a chaotic year (which is why I am so happy to have found HOD and am switching over asap!). So, out of those 2 kids, I chose Elissa who is very flexible, and a quick learner, and I gave her Switched On Schoolhouse Math grade 3. My thinking was, it's self teaching, it will relieve some of my stress. Well, we won't talk about all the bugs and problems that program has and the stress and tears it has caused my daughter when it counts things wrong that are in fact right.... moving on... she is about 1/2 way through that curriculum now. If she keeps doing 2 lessons per day she will be done by the end of May.

Seth, I kept with his Saxon because he doesn't handle change well. I bought him the Teacher DVD's to go along with it, and for the most part he has been independently doing it. However, when I grade his papers he makes alot of mistakes that are just silly, he rushes through, he gives me grief about doing it everyday, and he just in general hates it.

So I made the decision that we need to switch to SOMETHING new. Before I knew about HOD I had been looking at MathUSee. Now I am looking at Singapore as well. However, after scanning through the placement tests...I am so worried I have screwed up my kids and made them be behind. All of Elissa's friends who use Saxon are learning multiplication in 3rd grade....SOS hasn't touched on it. MathUSee also is Multipliation at level 3. 4th grade is Division which she would not be ready for now. So if I switch her over, now she is going to be a year behind on Math U See, and from what I can tell, Singapore might be the same! I dont' want her to be behind...I messed up.


Seth, I can't yet tell where he would place, but I worry he would be the same way. I feel like I have majorly messed up, and now my super smart daughter is going to be behind in math simply because of a curriculum choice, and all curriculms are different...
so my worry with her is her level placement..my worry with Seth is placement and just him finding something he enjoys. He is very oppositional as it already is with me about schoolwork.

Oh..and let me add that they ALL do not have their facts MEMORIZED. I still see the finger counting happening. I think it's because Saxon does not require mastery? I don't know.. But I have them doing xtramath.com everyday to help with that.
Advice?

[MomtoJGJE]

I do not know about curriculum other than singapore...

Have you had them take the singapore placement test?

Alternately, you could just start somewhere from 1A-2A and just go through it quickly. At their pace. Then when they get to things they don't know, you could then slow down.

FWIW, fingers are a type of manipulative. My kids still use their fingers or any other random things to help them get the answer. The reason I don't care that they do this is because they know HOW to do the math. They know WHY they are getting the answers they are getting. Repetition gives memorization.

[Cindygreen]

Don't worry, you haven't messed up. Your kids are still young. You will find them the right placement and they will do great. Remember don't compare them to other kids or to what Public or private schools are doing. Put them where they need to be.

I have used Math-U-See for several years. Don't think of the this program as grades but as levels. Where do your children place? What skill levels are they at? My oldest is dyslexic and struggles with math. I put him in Math-u-See in the middle of 6th grade and he went through all the elementary levels (except Beta) in 18 months. So in 8th grade he was able to take Pre-Algebra and now in 9th grade is doing Algebra I. He still struggles but he has a much stronger foundation so that he can complete high school level math. My youngest is a whiz at math and does excellent with math-u-see as well.

[mom23]

Oh, honey! I hear you. I don't have huge smashing advice for you, but I have felt like that sooo many times. Hang in there. I do know that it's very important to place your children where they are. If you put them in 4th grade math, just because they're in 4th grade, you're not doing anybody any favors. The kids are frustrated and hate math, and therefore, Mom is frustrated and hates math . Try not to worry so much about them being behind (I know, I know, easier said than done!) but if they are learning and progressing then it's the correct placement. And, I'm coming to feel that's is also important for them to develop a certain level of enjoyment for learning. I realize that math isn't eveyone's forte, but it does help if they atleast don't hate it. They begin to learn and cement much more if they like it a little. Honestly, are they going to be scarred for life and doomed to unsuccess if they learn to multiply in 4th grade, instead of 3rd? (Fwiw I have a 3rd grader who is still trying to work on addition/subtraction. I'm hoping to be able to start multiplication by next year.)

Here's the other big thing to keep in mind: "behind" for a curriculum like Singapore, for example, is not behind. I feel that many homeschool curricula are advanced compared to, say, public school classrooms. Singapore is definitely among the top of the homeschool curricula for being "advanced". I used a different curriculum for a while in which my children were both placed 2 years behind their grade level. I kept reading claims that it was advanced, but had begun to notice that many, if not most, homeschool curricula claim this, and this particular one was not advanced compared to Singapore and another one I had tried. Anyway, I had my daughter tested out of curiosity and she tested right at grade level-even though I thought we were 2 years behind! In switching curriculum you are going to run into certain concepts introduced at varying levels. So, if you need to back up a level to pick up something that they've never done before, you probably aren't as behind as it seems at first. You'll run into concepts that they have done and understand that you might be able to move very quickly through, or in some situations skip altogether.

[raindrops]

And... just because the public school is teaching at a certain level doesn't mean the kids have mastered it there either. Look at those test scores. I know I didn't always get "A's".

What about getting the level they are on, working at a comfortable pace, letting them build up confidence (and I would suggest getting the corresponding HOD teacher guide, if you could, just for Carrie's hands on math activities- well, if you chose Singapore) and then do math through summer with maybe some really fun books off HOD's reading list (she has a list of extra recommended books for $5). This would help catch up, get them use to the new math program and hopefully build their confidence.

See how long a day's instruction in Math-U-See takes. If it takes a long time it will add to your day (in an area that your kiddies might not appreciate! Hehe).

[creativemommy]

I will echo a few others... You haven't messed your kids up.

We have used Singapore the past four years and I am very pleased with it. I definitely echo the pp who suggested taking the placement tests. I wouldn't fret about the number on the front of the book. it is just a level. You want your kids to feel confident in math now, so when they are in upper levels it won't be such a struggle. Singapore is also a half-level or so (I can't remember exactly...sorry) ahead of other math programs.

Here are some ideas to review facts that we use a lot and my oldest two love them!

We use playing cards (numbers only, ace is one) and divide deck in half. You and student each turn one over and add or multiply depending on what facts he/she needs to work on. Person who says the right answer first takes both cards. Person with most cards at the end wins.

We also play a dice game with graph paper. Roll 2 dice (we have dice to 10 and 12) then add or multiply the numbers and fill in that many boxes on graph paper (I draw two equal large sections before the game starts). This game also works well for teaching area when boxes are filled in "7 down and 5 across" making "35".

[Joyful3]

We went through a similar situation with math, although my daughter is a little older.

My DD came home from public school last year for 5th grade. She was pretty shaky in her math skills. We started out in Teaching Textbooks which she initially liked but I could tell she was missing a thorough explanation of concepts. Mid-year we switched to MUS and it was a terrific fit for her. She spent a year doing fractions and really learned her concepts well. The review lessons really helped with some things she had missed before, too. After Christmas this year we moved her up to decimals and she's really flying!! I think we will finish that level by the end of the year. Over the summer we actually watched the DVD's for multiplication and division for a review of those concepts as well, and also really hit her facts so she could do them forward and backward. (Well, almost!)

All that to say, I did not count math as a strong subject for my DD until a couple of months ago. She has solidified her concepts so much and now I think it is one of her best subjects! I feel like we have actually gained a year of skills, as I look ahead to where she will probably be by 8th grade versus where I thought she would be by 8th grade just a year ago. And I thought I was going backwards a half a year when we switched curriculums!

Now all that is not to do a sell on MUS, just an example of how I don't think you can mess kids up when it comes to math even if you have to take some time to find the right fit. The beauty of homeschooling is that you can tailor things to your child's needs and then move through as quickly or slowly as they need. After being at this a year and a half, I am really seeing how our mistakes/struggles to find the right fit early on have begun to right themselves and it is this second year that I'm seeing how much of a difference homeschooling is making for my kids.

[Seashell517]

I can relate. We were actually unschooling for a while. Now talk about feeling like your kids are behind... Anyway I had to back my very intelligent 11 year old son to Singapore 2a last July. He's now half way through 3a. He's flying through this stuff now and retaining it as well. I think it's so important to start them where they are. My son has no idea that the numbers correspond with grades. I just call it level 3a. We need to do all we can to build our children's confidence and help them enjoy math. My son dreaded math and now it's the first book he grabs. I think we will probably be through 3b by summer and will keep working throughout the summer months on just math. He'll be at grade level someday but for now we are happy he's enjoying math and looks forward to it. Good luck with choosing the right curriculum and please don't feel like you've failed your kids. There's a lot more to life than math facts. You sound like a very caring mom and I'm sure you have children of great character and that's a much more sought after attribute than memorizing multiplication tables:).

[fullhands_fullheart]

Thank you so much for all the kind words of encouragement and advice! After each kid finishes the curriculum they are currently on, I think I will give them the placement tests for Singapore and MUS. I can't figure out between those 2 which to get. I'm hoping to get to look at them hands on this summer at the homeschool conference. I know MUS was there last year. It would help if I could look at them both.

I love the card and dice game idea. And I feel better about placing them "down" a level if needed. Thanks!